[dastudios]

Anyone manage to transcribe a double hand crossover? I just cant figure it out!!

[quack_stud]

I don't get what you mean?

[simidimpskin]

I may be wrong , but are you talking about the technic that Neil Peart uses at one point in his drum solo on the Rush in Rio dvd (for anyone whos seen it)

[dastudios]

Yes thats the one I mean - he does it in nearly all of his solos and a lot of it in the latest "Der Trommler" solo in Germany (R30 Tour)

He slows it down considerably in his dvd, Anatomy of a Drum Solo, but even then it is too fast for me to pick up.

Also he mentions 4-way independents - does anyone know what they are? He doesnt demonstrate, just says that hes still working on them 40 years later.

Thanks for the replies

[Metallish]

4-way independance is playing different independant beats with all four limbs. Most latin and fusion music utilises 4-way so get a latin or fusion-type learners or beginners book(no matter how good you are, go back to basics, start fresh) and start learning, then you can use it anywhere, metal, rock, country, jazz, et cetera.

A good example of this is Derek Roddy of hate eternal, playing 4/4 with his right foot, 3/4 with his left, he's got remote hh so he plays notes on his double kick then switches for two notes to the hh's. Then his hands do the opposite, right hand 3/4, left hand 4/4.

Another is Mike Mangini and some of his solos and Steve Vai songs.

Its all about isolating then strengthening each limb seperately, when you are just sitting around at home play a time signature beat with your hand, then switch it, use quarter, eighth and sixteenth notes, play 2/4(half-time) 3/4 4/4 2/3 4/7 and so on time signatures, and do with with your other hand, then one foot, then the other, then sit down and practice that on a drumset. Its abou playing anything at anytime with your hands and feet.

Hope this helps man, its how I powered my 4-way.

Good Luck,

Metallish

[UPSTROKE]

For those of you that are using double bass, this might be a fun way to do some
independence. Start with just your snare & slowly play triplets - counting -
1-&-uh, 2- &-uh, etc. Add 1 bass drum - on 1-2-3-4-. Very easy, right??
Now add the second bass - counting - 1-&-2-&-3-&-4-&-. You are playing 1/8 notes with your feet, & triplets with your hands. Maybe most of you young guys will find this to be like rolling off a log. I didn't. It took awhile. After you get it so you can play it, reverse your feet. Then reverse your hands. How about 5 against 4??--& on-& on-& on---

[UPSTROKE]

Originally Posted by dastudios

Anyone manage to transcribe a double hand crossover? I just cant figure it out!!

I went back thru some old Modern Drummer mags and found this. An article by
Rod Morgensein. He says this is what a lot of Neil's crossovers are based on.
Basically a Swedish triplet. I've photocopied the article into small readable sections so that you can read it. I hope it help, & I hope it's not illegal. I don't
think it is because nobody is doing this for profit.
X- OVERS 1.jpg

X-OVERS 2.jpg

X- OVERS 3.jpg

X-OVERS 4.jpg

[skinslapper]

Originally Posted by UPSTROKE

For those of you that are using double bass, this might be a fun way to do some
independence. Start with just your snare & slowly play triplets - counting -
1-&-uh, 2- &-uh, etc. Add 1 bass drum - on 1-2-3-4-. Very easy, right??
Now add the second bass - counting - 1-&-2-&-3-&-4-&-. You are playing 1/8 notes with your feet, & triplets with your hands. Maybe most of you young guys will find this to be like rolling off a log. I didn't. It took awhile. After you get it so you can play it, reverse your feet. Then reverse your hands. How about 5 against 4??--& on-& on-& on---

Yeah, I found myself doing that while I was on the pratice pad the other day. Felt good.

My favourite demonstrator of four way independance is our true-blue Grant Collins. Check out some vids of him here

http://www.grantcollins.com/intro.htm

[mouse]

That crossover thing looks like what Gene Krupa does in one of his solo's ( probally where Neil Peart got it from. I think it was on the Steve Smith DVD that shows it.
For a great co ordination exercise book can recommend Tiger Bill Maligari's "Double Drumming". Check out his web site for details, it's not expensive.
It is written for double kick but very usefuil for any drummer to get the feet, hands and head around co ordination. A book you can also use away from the drum kit which is handy.

[UPSTROKE]

Well I got surprised. I thought there would more of a reaction to the music bits that I posted. Some questions?? something. I guess I'm just getting too old and every body is way past this stuff. Thanks to you two guys for responding. Very kind of you.